SPEAKER_04 0:31

This is only the beginning, even though it's been out of control. This is only the beginning, even though it feels just like the end. Everything seems wrong now, but somehow beautiful. It's the world we want to where we go we don't know. It is only the big candy. Even the candy out of the boat. It is only the big candy. Even the beautiful dog. But our life has only started to begin. Oh no! It's like it's all and up to live. But our life has only started to begin.

SPEAKER_02 3:26

And we're gonna do a bit of a unique episode where Laura and Shelly are going to interview each other and we're gonna get to listen to this conversation. So, yeah, Laura, would you start us off and then yeah, let's uh let's go ahead and learn about each of your centers.

SPEAKER_00 3:42

Okay, well, Jacob, thanks for having us um on your podcast today. My name is Laura Messick, and I am the executive director of the Portico Pregnancy Resource Center. We're located in Murfreesboro, Tennessee, which is just 30 miles east of Nashville. Um we are, I'd say, a mid-sized pregnancy center doing probably what's considered typical pregnancy tests, ultrasounds. Uh, we're now doing STI testing and treatment, early prenatal care, um, APR, abortion pill reversal protocol. We also then teach in the Rutford County Schools, where we're located in 19 schools, junior high and high school, a sexual risk avoidance program that we call Optimal Health for Me, OH for M. We have a men's program, we do post-abortive services. Um trying to figure out what am I forgetting? Uh a lot of client services and special family services that we do. So we are 40 years old this year. We started in night we opened in 1986, and I mentioned to you earlier that I'm one of the founders of this ministry. Um, my story, I'll try to be as brief as I can. It it's I was a young woman, 24 years old, with a stay a stay-at-home mom with my first baby, maybe 25. And I saw a news story um on the 700 Club, which at the time when you live in a small town or sm smaller then than it is now, um, you've got three stations and then the local Channel 17. So I saw this news story on uh the 700 Club about a dumpster in California that had been repossessed, and s uh a company had been hired, well, the people that repossessed it hired some guys to clean it out, and it was found to be full of abortive babies and many of them late term. And apparently that was a pretty big story back then, and it's been a long time ago. It's been 40 years ago since well, 40 plus years ago since I saw that story. And as a young Christian woman, when I saw that, I was just my heart was literally just pierced by the Lord. I had never thought about abortion personally. I I'm not post-abortive. I didn't know anybody who was post-abortive. I was what you call a good little Christian church going girl. Um and really abortion was not in my it was not in my mind. But at that time as a young adult who was seeking the Lord on my own, the Lord just, the Holy Spirit just lit me up about this. I started talking about it, really couldn't hush talking about it. Um my husband and I were part of a tiny little church, non-denominational church at the time, and a small, even smaller, small group within that little bitty church. And we began praying about it. It became a focus of prayer. And over the course of a couple of years, God connected us with other people in our community, several of whom had seen that same program that I had seen. And we put an ad in the paper, formed the steering committee, um, later a board of directors, and in 1986 we opened our doors just to do pregnancy tests because that's what you did. The thought be being there needs to be a place for women to come besides Planned Parenthood where they can go and and talk to someone. You know, it was not professional counseling, it was lay counseling, peer counseling, um but just to have someone to talk through and and somebody that would listen and offer help. Um, and back then when we first opened, I don't think you could even get an over-the-counter pregnancy test. You just had to go to your doctor's office. Within a few years, the over-the-counter pregnancy tests were beginning to be more widely available. But I remember because with my third pregnancy, um, I actually came to our pregnancy center and got my test done because they were fifty dollars or so. And so that was a big draw back then in the in the late 80s, early 90s, just was the fact that we did a free pregnancy test. So that's how Portico was born. We were we opened as the Crisis Pregnancy Support Center, later dropped crisis and became pregnancy support center, and in 2013 did a rebrand, uh, which I can go into later if you want to know the reasons behind that, and became Portico. So I will stop and hush as we say in the South and let let Shelly uh start talking.

SPEAKER_01 7:39

Yeah, so Laura and I share a lot of similarities with our centers. We're both celebrating 40 years of ministry this year. Both of us were founded in 1986. Um, and uh really across the nation, many, many pregnancies were birthed around that same time. It was almost as if the Holy Spirit was just moving across the country uh in response to Roe versus Wade and also just seeing abortion numbers skyrocketing. Um, us in Memphis and Shelby County, we had the highest rate of abortions taking place in the entire state at around 12,500 a year. Uh, and so our founders were two married couples that went to a conference. They were actually in radio broadcasting is kind of what they what they were doing. But so they were at a conference that just so happened to have a speaker that addressed the issue of abortion. And it was at that moment that it really brought it to the forefront of their minds. And they said, We can't continue without doing something about this. And they there was a very specific prayer that they prayed that basically was asking God why he's not doing something about abortion in Memphis. And the answer very clearly back from the Lord was, Why aren't you doing something? Um, and so that is the birth of Life Choices of Memphis was just for individuals who love the Lord and it was oppressed upon their hearts that we needed to do something in Memphis. Um, we ran some numbers back when abortion, before Roe versus Wade was overturned, um, we ran some numbers just to see the impact of our pregnancy center over the course of 35 years. And when we were founded, of course, we had 12,500 abortions taking place. We saw a 70% decline in abortions in Shelby County as a direct result of our ministry being founded and established here. Um, that's not because of any one individual person or talent that we have, it's simply because of God working through our ministry and allowing us opportunities to meet women where they are. Um, and it's a truly a privilege for me to even be a part of it. I feel especially blessed in a different way than Laura does. Laura has the cool story of founding it. I have the the humbling story of just being able to inherit what has already been laid in and foundation form before I got here. Um so I can't I don't want to take credit for any of it, but it's just been it's been the faithful work of many, many people for 40 years. Um but now life choices, we're seeing around 3,500 client visits a year. Well, last year we did over 1,600 ultrasounds, um, similar to Portico and Murfreesboro. We also do APR abortion pill reversal and many of those uh services with pregnancy tests and ultrasounds and counseling and all of those things. We also are a licensed adoption agency in Mississippi and Tennessee, which makes us a little unique. I think there are only five in the country now that are pregnancy centers and adoption agencies. Um we, and we've been doing that since we were founded. Uh, and it's a beautiful picture of uh a way for a mom to as she's making the decision of whether to parent, whether to have an abortion, or whether to place her baby for adoption. We very readily have vetted families um in a binder that are ready to be chosen. They've already been cleared through um all of our parameters and they are it's a it's a neat thing that we can offer to our clients as an option. Um as far as my pro-life story, it's kind of interesting. I um I was a stay-at-home mom for 10 years and helped my husband get his business off the ground. He is in baseball world, so we are a baseball family and we have a baseball training facility in town. And so back in the early years of being a mom and uh being newly married, we dove right into small business world and getting uh his business off the ground. Um I had a college degree, I had a career before having kids uh in nonprofit world and staying at home as a mom was was definitely a blessing, but also one of the hardest things I've ever done. Uh and I remember very vividly a moment in time where I'm under my kitchen table and I'm picking dried Cheerios up off the ground on the tile floor and they would not come up. And it was like a breaking moment for me of just, is this my life? Like, is this it? Is this what you have for me, God? And uh of course, as I'm saying that to God, I'm going, well, obviously, if this is his plan for me, then I need to be content and okay with it, like Paul talks about, but I'm not, I'm not happy right here. And I have I have a college degree, and what am I doing? You know, all of that to say, fast forward 10 years later, um, I fell into the the role here. It wasn't posted on any uh anything. It was a friend of a friend that introduced me to this ministry. And as I got into the job that I was hired for, I realized very quickly how the Lord had been equipping me all along the way for this very job and this very role. I was keeping um the accounting books for my husband's business. I was learning how to hire employees and train employees, and all that it takes to run a business is very comparable to how it is being a CEO here in this role. Um, and so God did not waste a single moment of me picking off Cheerios off the ground. He used it for his glory and his good, um, and was training me all along for the role that I'm in now. Um real quick, one sweet story that I always love to tell people is when I was hired, I was hired here in January of 2019 and I had always considered myself pro-life. And all I knew that that meant was that you vote accordingly every four years when the polls are open. Um, I did not know that you could do anything else to help in that area, uh ashamedly so. I should have asked more questions and should have gotten more involved. But in my mind, I just said, yes, I'm pro-life, and I'll vote for the president that says they're pro-life, and that was it. Um when I got the job here and I realized, wait, there's so much we can be doing. Um I was sitting on the couch with my husband watching the news. It was January 22nd, 2019, and it was the day of the Reproductive Health Act that was passed in New York. And I don't know if y'all remember, but they lit up all the buildings in New York City were lit up in pink, and everyone was celebrating, and it basically had legalized abortion all the way up to birth in the state of New York. And I remember being heartbroken, watching on the couch with my husband and crying, and then looking at him and going, I get to do something about this starting tomorrow. And I started my day at Life Choices the next day. Um, I love that story because to me it means God can use anybody, and you don't have to just be complacent about saying, Well, I'm pro-life. I vote, I vote pro-life. All of us have a role in this beyond just voting, and we all should be taking a stand and putting our faith to action. Um, you don't all have to be on the payroll at a pregnancy center, but you can volunteer your time, you can donate to a pregnancy center, you can pray for our employees, our staff, our clients who are coming through these doors every single day.

SPEAKER_02 16:01

That's really good. So I've got a question. Um, I've got a question for well, the two of you. So, so Shelly, you know, as someone who's been working in this area for four years, um, and also Laura, you've been working as the director, I think, for 18 years. What's it look like when it comes to so Shelly, when it comes to having someone with you know deep roots in this work coming alongside and and and having a place to go for answers, how can that be helpful? And then Laura, maybe you could go next and say, as someone with deep roots in this work, you know, you know, is it, you know, what are your thoughts on helping someone who is in that you know newer chapter when they're in that first year of um taking on that role? So yeah, Shelly, go ahead and go, and then we'll let Laura pick up on the second part.

SPEAKER_01 16:53

I think Laura might already know what I'm about to say. Um, and she doesn't like it when I call her this, but she is Queen Laura. She is Queen Laura. And the reason that I call her that is not anything to do with her thinking that she is better than other other people or royal or regal or any of that, although she is all of those things. Um my reason that I call her Queen Laura is because she is a mentor to me. Um, she has helped guide me in this path. Um, when I became CEO, I felt like I was drinking out of a water hose. I had no idea what I was doing. And Laura has always um been so full of wisdom and so full of just really just grace uh with me as I've asked her questions and and had questions about this pro-life work in general and what uh what stand we should be taking. Um she's a natural leader um and she uh has been tremendous with helping guide me in my role here. And I would encourage any new pregnancy center leader to seek a Queen Laura in their own lives.

SPEAKER_00 18:08

She gets me every time with that Jacob. Because I always say they call me that because I'm the old lady in the bunch in Tennessee, and I really am. I started out one of the younger ones, you know, 18 years ago when I became the director, but I've watched a lot of this age out. And um you know, it's in hearing Shelly say that, the humbling thing for me is I have a little bit of a different take on the part that she was talking about the Cheerios, digging in the floor, you know, with the Cheerios. I was never uh career minded. I was a stay-at-home mom was my career of choice. Um, I helped put my husband through college. I went to college, did not finish because I wanted to start having babies. So we got him through college, and that felt like that was a long enough time. I was looking back on it. It wasn't. I I could have gone on, but I didn't. But my sister and my sister-in-law and everybody around me was having babies. I was ready to start my career as a stay-at-home mom. So I did. My husband was able to support us. He started a business, uh, like Shelly. We we kind of got into that early on, and I helped him with his business in some ways. But um, I was just really blessed and excited to be able to do what my heart's desire had always been. Now, that's not to say, and I think you get perspective on this as you get older and you've raised your kids. That's a training ground. Like you said, Shelly, it it trains you, and I've told my own daughters that there's nothing that trains you more for the next thing that God has for you than being a mom, whether you stay at home or not. I know lots of working moms, and it's it's the same thing, no matter if you're home with them or you work part-time or full-time, you're still a mom. And there is nothing better to train you for ministry, um, mentoring, uh, just being a servant in the kingdom of God than mothering your own children. So I did that for 25 years, and I say that because I put some I put nine years between my first one and my last one. So I had um I had a a a large range of years that we had kids in school, we you know, all of that, never expecting to go to work. Um, Trent and I, my husband is Trent, and we this was kind of the work of our life starting this pregnancy center with with a group of people here in Murfreesboro. And we both were board members. Um, I was the banquet chairman, I've been a volunteer. I did the first volunteer training. Interestingly, Lucy Prieg, who was the longtime director of the whole clinic in Nashville, was the person who helped us get our pregnancy center started. She came and helped us get all of our paperwork set up and um helped us train our first group of volunteers. So I was in on that. And I always loved doing this. And my contribution later became I was the banquet person, you know, for years and years and years before there was email, I was on the phone harassing people. I need your names, I need to know if you're coming, you know, all of that. Um, so that was my story, and I never expected to be in this role. Uh like I said, I've always been involved. Eventually, when my youngest, my youngest, which is my son, was in junior high school, began to realize, okay, my girls were grown by then, married, and um, I thought, I need there needs to be something else in my life. Um, but because I didn't finish school, I I I thought, well, what Lord, what can I do? So there was an ad for a party rental store where I had just helped d done my daughter's wedding. They had been my our store, and they were looking for help. So I ended up working there. And they kind of laughed at me when I filled out my application because when it got to experience, I'm just sitting over there laughing, going, I don't have any. You know, I did, obviously, God showed me that later. But um, I did that, became the manager, did that for four years, and then the position here opened up. I was on the board at the time, and it opened up, and I was asked to step in and fill this role, and it was very much a who me moment, you know, me. So that's why when Shelly says that it's it's um it is humbling because I look at Shelly and these younger women that are now in this world of the pro life director world, and I'm so amazed and blown away by them. They they all know, we all laugh, because like Shelly said, we're both um board members in the Tennessee Pregnancy Center Network. If there's anything techy, I I'm like, y'all do that. I'll I'll look at it when you get it done. They bussed at me one uh last year we were having a board meeting in person. We usually do it by Zoom, and they all had their laptops out. I'm sitting there with my little iPad that won't do. And they said, Why don't you have a laptop? I said, 'Cause I don't want one. I don't want a laptop, but Guess what? I got a laptop. So now I can. But it there's so much that God has done with these younger women and bringing them along. And really that was one of the first things he showed me when I came in as the director was that my generation, both as donors uh in this movement, as volunteers, as as leaders, we're aging out. So we better get busy and pull these millennials along with us. Or some of them were exes, some of them are old enough to be Gen X, but most of them are millennials. Now we've got even have Gen Z's working in our world. And so I really had a sense of of that from the Lord that we need to bring the next generation along. And it thrills me to see that God has done that and we can encourage these younger women and and they can encourage me, encourage us, older girls, um, because there's things that I need that that they can teach me. Um so it it is, but it is a good thing when you can encourage others and when you can be encouraged. Um and it the another thing that's really it really been a blessing to me is how God has shown us, even in our state of Tennessee, Shelley, that He's still opening centers up. It it's not it's not just something from the past. One of our board members, her pregnancy center is, I think, are they celebrating six years this year, Shelley? Kathleen? Yes. Another one probably is six or seven years old that's in our network. There's another one that we're working with that's getting ready to open up. So it is ongoing, and it's not something that has ever stopped. God's spirit is still moving on communities and people to open up these places of refuge for women to come when they are facing an unplanned pregnancy. So um, I don't know if we answered your question or not, but that's that's it's it's been really exciting to see that, and it's good to be at the phase I am and at the base that uh Shelley is.

SPEAKER_02 24:22

Yeah, yeah, I so w one of the needs in our movement is unity, unity amongst um pre precinctors working together, unity amongst different groups working together, and and sometimes um groups, you know, e each group seems some sometimes there's like friendly competition going over going after maybe the same donor or going after the same project, and we really need to get more into, you know, we're we're serving the same Jesus, and there's you know, we need to find unity even when we're you know, maybe we would gravitate towards competition in some spaces. And so unity is so important, and yet it's often, you know, not what's currently real. Some and some and so it's a good example. I I just it seemed like this was a good example of unity, but there's also, I would say, that's a need that's that shows up um in this work is that we need more unity and we need to and we need to emphasize and encourage unity.

SPEAKER_01 25:19

That's one thing I've loved about being a part of our state network is the unity that's in that network of pregnancy centers. There's um a mutual respect for our own respective territories, if you want to say territories, um and just a love for one another and a love for the Lord, um, but also just a way for us to edify each other. We have a uh conference every year in Chattanooga. It's been the past couple years in Chattanooga, um, and it's a time for us to all come together and share ideas. Nobody is gatekeeping their best idea because they want to be the best. Everyone is sharing ideas so that we can all learn, all be better, all improve, all be above reproach, um, all have best practices. Anything that I'm doing well, I want to share with the rest of the pregnancy centers in the country. And I think that that really is the mentality of most of us uh in this landscape.

SPEAKER_02 26:22

Yeah, I that's good. So so doing this work, so so Laura and Shelly, I want you to think about what, you know, for your center, what is your current greatest need? Um, and so sometimes when I ask that question to a director, you know, some directors will say to reach more abortion vulnerable clients, some some will say to raise more money, some will say to raise more volunteers, some will say to be aware for awareness to grow in their community. So, but for your centers, um, so Laura, what do you think is your greatest need for your center, or one of your great, you know, maybe maybe not the greatest need, but one of your greatest needs currently.

SPEAKER_00 27:24

You know, that that is such a good question, and it's it's a hard one to answer. And it's it's funny because I addressed that very thing in in one of my donor letters not too long ago. I can't remember what the context is of why I got into that, but you get asked that question a lot when you do what Shelly and I do. What is your greatest need? And I think everybody expects it to be financial or um, like you said, we want to see more abortion vulnerable women. Uh obviously, of course, we do. Um, and so I give an answer that's probably a little bit surprising to people because I think, and and this, I don't mean this to be a cop-out, I will give you a a more physical real need in a minute, but um the most I think the most critical need that we have is to really be covered in prayer. I don't think people understand how important that is. Because we can do all the marketing things we want to do, we can do all of the outreach things in our communities that we can do, but if we don't have God directing what we're doing, it it is not gonna work. It's gonna fall on its face. Um so there are times that feel dry and feel like where are the people? Where where are women? Some days we can hardly keep our heads above water. There's so many people coming in. And then other days you realize you're kind of in a little bit of a lull season. Not that nobody comes in, but it just it feels that way a little bit. Um, so prayer that God would, and literally uh Shelly and I did a show with someone a couple of months ago, and I can't remember her name right now, Shelly. You may. Um, Shelly and I do a radio show together for Bot Radio, so if you wonder what I'm referring to there. Um we did a show with the Pregnancy Center Director, and she said her prayer every day is Lord, exhaust us in service to you. Let us come to the end of the day and be exhausted because we have served all the people you've sent us. Lord, send us everyone in our community that needs what we do. So that is my prayer for Portico that that all the women that are at our local university, Middle Tennessee State University, which is the largest undergrad university in Tennessee, um, and I know there are so many women there that need what Portico has, um, that Lord would they find us instead of finding their way to the abortion pill. Um, and fighting the battle. So if you want a real kind of physical thing that is the greatest need that we have, I think it would be fighting the battle of the communication and the messaging uh from TikTok and Instagram and all of these platforms to young women that the abortion pill is their answer and it's the easy way out. Um that's really the battle that we're fighting right now. Uh I know in Tennessee it's an abortion's not legal in Tennessee. Um, and so, but abortion still goes on in Tennessee because of the abortion pill. So that's probably the biggest need is that people be educated about that and um be aware of it. We've all spent a good amount of effort educating our donors and our supporters about what abortion pill, about that process. You don't just take a pill and you're suddenly unpregnant. And I think a lot of younger women think that because the culture wants them to be confused and wants them not to understand the truth about it. So for us to, I know at our banquet last year, my nurse, uh, our medical services director, my nurse manager, DeAndra, um, educated our audience on the whole process. And people, and these are pro-life people and people that have supported Portico for a long time. And so many people have have told me, have told her that night, I had no idea. I had no idea. And then certainly they don't know what the abortion pill reversal process is, that that's even possible. And if they have heard something, they've probably heard that it's fake, it's not true. Well, I believe the latest stat is there are 9,000 documented children alive on this earth because of abortion pill reversal. So I think I I'm kind of realizing it's prayer, it's it's helping us educate people as to what truth is and countering the cultural message that wants to keep people in the dark, wants to keep them confused and truly misinformed about these very crucial um situations.

SPEAKER_01 31:29

So I would 100% agree with Laura on that. We absolutely need prayer. Um I my biggest fear as the leader of a pregnancy center is being outside of God's will and leading us down a path that we're not meant to be at. And um very specifically with our center this year, it seems that a lot of big growth things are kind of all converging at once. And so it's really scary for me as a leader. Uh, we have an opportunity to open a brand new center, it's expand another center that we are already in, another location. Um, and then we have two uh new programs we're offering that have we've had hire staff for. Um and we have more staff now than we've ever had. So it's we're in a a real period here in Memphis of growth. Uh, and we need the prayer and the support from our donors and from our prayer warriors. We need that to match the growth that we're seeing. It feels like God is really on the cusp of moving in a huge way in our area, and we want to be ready for it. So that's my specific request is for prayer and support, similar to Laura's. Um, but also prayer for our staff. They're facing life and death scenarios every single day. And some of them are heartbreaking, some of them are they feel hopeless, um, and they are showing up to work every single day faithfully, um putting that armor on and opening the next door and talking to the next client who needs them. And uh they constantly need prayer uh for encouragement and just to keep going. Amen.

SPEAKER_02 33:27

Wow. All right. So, Laura, I've got a follow-up question on prayer for you, which is which Bible passage or which verse or Bible passage shows up in your prayer, prayer, yeah, in the prayer that you do for your center and for the work that you're doing, or which Bible passage really sort of speaks to your heart and yeah, it gets weaved into your prayers?

SPEAKER_00 33:51

Right now, um, that God is able to do exceedingly abundantly more than we can ask or imagine. That has been that's been part of what's been in my mind for this pregnancy center for probably the last six or seven years. Our founding uh scripture is that we don't wrestle against flesh and blood, but against powers and principalities in the in the heavenly realms, and to put on the full armor of God. And that's that's what we were founded on was that scripture. And it's still very foundational for us that that's what that's where our battle is. So sometimes if we get sideways with each other about methods or or you know, things like that, remembering that our our our our battle is not with flesh and blood, it's certainly not with each other, it's not with the women who are having abortions. Our our battle is with the enemy. But right now, um about mm, well, pretty much from the time I came in as the director, I realized that we needed more space. So we spent some time kind of thinking and considering that. Didn't really see how in the world we could could do that because we were not in a great financial place when I came in. Um, but God has been faithful to help us build that back up. And so five years ago, we we took occupation of a brand not a brand new building, new to us, but that we had totally renovated. Um and the lady who was my part-time development director at the time, I didn't have a full-time one yet, she had given me that scripture. She had had typed it out in a pretty font, made it look all pretty, and she gave it to me. And I thought, okay, because we were going to need about two million dollars to do this. And it was God is able to do exceedingly abundantly more than than you we can ask or imagine. And so that became sort of what resonated with me when I prayed uh for Portico. And I have watched him in these last six, eight years do exceedingly abundantly more than I could ask or imagine. And so he wants us to ask, and he wants us to imagine, but he's gonna do more. Um, so he gave us an incredible building that doubled our space, and even better than that, it's paid for. Um, so you know, that's that's the scripture. So I need to hold on to that when I'm thinking about the other things that I talked about, the brokenness of the people that we see and the and the and the misinformation and all of the things that are out there culturally that we're fighting, remembering that God is able to do exceedingly abundantly more than we can ask or imagine.

SPEAKER_02 36:18

Wow. So so Shelly, how does that verse sorry? So Shelly, how does that verse resonate with you and the work that you're doing as you hear that verse of God will do more than you imagine?

SPEAKER_01 36:32

It's it's such a reminder, uh, and I'm so glad Laura brought that verse up because um she's right. It doesn't necessarily have to just do with God's provision either. I'm recalling just a story that happened this past Saturday that God did exceedingly more than we could have ever thought or asked. We we have a men's ministry now. Um Laura's Laura's men's director has actually helped us get started with that. Um, but we're going on two years now of having our men's ministry. And this past Saturday, several of the men who had placed their faith in Christ through the ministry asked to be baptized. And Justin, who's on staff with us as our men's ministry director, is also a pastor. And so he was he offered to do the baptisms for these clients in his swimming pool in his backyard. And what is exceedingly and abundantly more than we could have ever hoped or prayed for is the plan was just to baptize two men who are both uh clients of ours that came through the program because their girlfriends were pregnant and were going through the program here at Life Choices, and they both accepted Christ. They've been discipled and wanted to be baptized. Well, when we got to the event, several family members of the clients were in attendance, and one of them was the brother of one of the men being baptized, and he started asking questions. He ended up placing his faith in Christ. We shared the gospel with him, he got saved, got baptized in his clothes that day in the swimming pool. And it so we had three instead of two, and it's just another stamp of approval of the Lord saying, you know, if we put if we step forward in obedience and we do the work, God is going to bless it more than we could ever have imagined. So great verse, Laura. Well, that's simple.

SPEAKER_00 38:31

That's an awesome story to illustrate it. It's wonderful.

SPEAKER_02 38:35

All right. So, Shelly, which verse uh shows up in your prayers or has shown up in your thoughts around your clinic?

SPEAKER_01 38:42

Yeah, so we are in the in the throes right now of planning our banquet, our big fundraiser of the year. Um, and it's the 40th year celebration. So there's a lot surrounding that, a lot of excitement. But the verse that we chose to kind of be the theme of our banquet this year is John 21, 25, which says there are also many other things that Jesus did were every one of them to be written. I suppose the world itself could not contain the books that would be written. And so it's this idea of we have so many stories of God's goodness, of God's faithfulness, of God bringing people to himself over the past 40 years. We couldn't contain it in all the books in the world. Um, and God's doing that everywhere. Um, but it's such a neat way to celebrate all the things that he has done over four decades through life choices. So that's kind of the verse I've been meditating on lately.

SPEAKER_02 39:38

That's really good. So would you share one of your favorite stories or a story that comes to mind at least?

SPEAKER_01 39:43

Sure. This is the best part of any interview I'm ever in, is when somebody says, tell a story, because I usually have a very recent one that can um that I can share. Um if I get up from my desk and walk around right now, I would have a story for you in a few minutes because that's just how much God is working. That's one of the best things about um what we do here is that uh God allows us to see behind the curtain. You know, not not every ministry, not every mission project are you able to see results in real time here on earth. But I think because of the gravity of what we do here, God also is so gracious to let us see um some of the fruits, everything come to fruition on this side of heaven. We don't we don't see everything, but we see enough to keep us going to the next day. But um one story I heard about this past week was uh a young lady that came in and she was, we have a scale. Um, I don't know, Jacob, if you're familiar with uh pregnancy centers kind of have an assessment tool that we use, and it's basically how abortion determined are you on a scale of zero to 10. Um, 10 being you are determined to have an abortion, you already have your appointment made, you're just here for the confirmation of pregnancy, and that's it. Nothing can really talk you out of it. And then zero is you're so excited, and you have all the support in the world, and there's nothing to stop you from being a mom. Um, and then everything in between. Well, this this woman in particular was a 10. She was abortion determined, already had her appointment, nothing you can say to talk her out of it. Um, and the nurses and the client advocates spent some extra time with her just explaining the process of the abortion, not a fear tactic by any means, but like with any surgery or any major medical procedure that you would have done, like you need to know what all is entailed uh in that process. And so they just kind of went over this is what an abortion is. This is um, they want we want to make sure that you're um aware of all of it, all the risks and that kind of thing. And then we want you to know we'll be here for you regardless of your choice. We are here for you to help meet your needs, whatever that looks like. Well, she said, nobody's ever really spent any time with me. Nobody has ever really taken the time to tell me anything about my health. Um, so just that spending time with her and finding out what her um challenges were was meaningful to her. But then she got into the ultrasound room and saw that she was having twins. And something changed in her when she saw that there were two heartbeats in that womb instead of just the just the one. She still was probably around a six or a seven on being determined to have that abortion, even with the twins. Um, she was terrified of her dad finding out, and she did not want him to find out. So she was going to just take care of this before it becomes an issue. Uh, well, the nurses and the client advocates, first of all, encouraged her to come back just to talk about it a little bit more. She came back, had another ultrasound. Um, they encouraged her to tell her father. They said, We know this is gonna be hard for you, but we really feel like as part of you making this decision, you need to talk to your dad about it. So she went home and she told her dad, and she texted one of our client advocates that night and said, I told my dad, and he wasn't mad at me. In fact, he said that he would be much more angry if I had gone ahead with the abortion, that those were his grandchildren, and they were so excited to have twins. And so she has now chosen to parent and is now going to signed up for our baby prep classes and is going to have those twin babies. Um, and that is uh real time. I just found out about it last week. Uh, but the reality is we're seeing that all the time here at Life Choices and at Portico and pregnancy centers across the country.

SPEAKER_02 44:05

Wow. That's such a good story, thank you, Shelley. Um Laura, yeah, would you would you share a story where you've seen, you know, from your from your work, your center's work, your your team's work, um, where God has worked through in this area, and you can highlight, yeah, what you know, what he's doing, and yeah, just share a story of the work.

SPEAKER_00 44:26

I'll go a little bit in a different direction than Shelly, because she's right. There's we have stories that we can tell all the time of of of the joyful moments, and those are wonderful and they carry us. But um we we also have a a mobile ultrasound, an ICU mobile ultrasound at Portico. And several years ago we were out, and I don't remember where we were, but a young woman um came. In and she had a pregnancy test, and and we did an ultrasound for her. And when the ultrasound was over, she sat up on the table with tears just rolling down her cheeks. And she said, Wow. She said, I wish every woman who was pregnant and and thinking about an abortion could get one of those. She said, I wish I had had that the first time. So she was already post-abortive. And I don't remember if she had stated or where she was on the scale. Um, but I just know that that ultrasound made all the difference for her. To be able to see that baby's heartbeat and to see the actual form of her baby um made such a difference in her in her heart. And so that story has never I've never forgotten that because when I was very first, when we were very first opened 40 years ago, and I was one of the counselors, um, a young woman came in and we went through all the things that we did. At that time, it was a pregnancy test. Like I said, we didn't do ultrasound. There wasn't much else to offer, but we talked and we conversed and we had questions, we asked, and um, she told me she said she said, Well, this is she said, I had another one. I had my first abortion when I was 16 years old. And she was probably maybe 19 at that time. And she said, and uh, my mother took me to get it, and I I wasn't asked, she just took me and she said, when it was over, she turned to me and looked and said, Now we don't ever have to speak about that again, do we? And she said, and we never have. And again, the tears were just rolling down her cheeks. I have never forgotten that. I don't remember much from 40 years ago, but I remember that. And then to hear the other story, probably thirty-five years later, of that young woman after we, you know, we had been all offering ultrasound for a while at that point, to sit up on the table and to verbalize what a difference that that had made for her to be able to see that. Um that's that's a powerful story to me because I kind of connect the two. Um, and thinking, what if at that time we had had ultrasound that we could have given that young woman? I don't know what she went and chose. This the first one I I I talked about. It's been so long ago. Um, but just the power of that ultrasound, and we had another we had just a more recent story, probably three weeks ago, we had a young mom come in with a five-year-old child and she had brought us a box of little goodies that she had made. She started something called Random Acts of Sweetness. And she had had done a screen thing of our logo. Again, there's all that technical stuff that I don't understand. But she had had put our logo on these little cookies and these little she'd put little pretzel sticks that she dipped in chocolate and used our colors, you know, and um and and just it was a thank you box. And she did a little post about it on her on her social media and told us that he her little boy was in the picture and on the box and he had a sign up, he started kindergarten this year because of what the counselor at Portico helped her through at a really hard time of her life. So those stories are so gratifying for us when women come back and they'll walk in and they'll have a baby on their hip and they'll say, I wanted to introduce you to my baby, and we'll go back and look in their records and realize that they left us with us not knowing they were they might have still been abortion-minded and on that scale somewhere, but because truth spoken in love was given to them and ministry, not manipulation, was given to them, they were able to walk out. And I pray that a lot for people when I hear some of the stories from our nurses and I realize how bad a situation might be, and I'll say, Lord, just let there be something that was said in that room, um, or something that was shared that will that she'll remember and that the Lord will Lord use that and send another person along to add to that so that she'll choose life. So those stories are are so great when we get to know um that even if we didn't think so, she might have chosen life and we get to find out about it later.

SPEAKER_01 48:48

Laura we had this reminds me of uh another story. We had a client come back um and asked to speak to Denise, a specific client advocate that was her person. It was a year later and Denise had shared the gospel with her and she had rejected it at the time and had left angry. She came back a year later and said that she'd accepted Christ and that she never forgot what Denise had shared with her and wanted to thank her for being faithful in that, even though she didn't accept it at the time. So another picture of of God allowing us to see, you know, some of those seeds that we've planted growing exceedingly abundantly more, right? Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 49:31

And I think that's something for us to remember in the work that we do, because there can be so many discouraging times and moments when we think we've gotten through, and then you get their uh their their their sheep when they're leaving and they've filled out their little survey and and they're still undecided or you know, they haven't necessarily moved where we wanted them to be. But don't stop praying, just keep praying. You know, um at the end of the week sometimes or over the weekend, I'll I'll pray for everybody who's been in Portico that week. Lord, be at work in their lives this weekend. Bring people into their paths that are gonna encourage them toward life. So um yeah, that's important.

SPEAKER_02 50:10

Wow, that's so good. Yeah, sometimes when someone plants a seed, it may not germinate for quite some time. But yeah, it needs yeah, the soil, the water. Yeah, it takes time sometimes for those for those pieces to come together.

SPEAKER_00 50:24

And can I add something to that, Jacob, that you just mentioned? Um I know for a lot of us at in the pregnancy center world, sometimes that you can feel heaviness like I've got to get them saved while they're here. That's part of my job. I've got to I've gotta make sure they're saved when they walk out of here. Um I heard a teaching uh or a a a keynote, I think, at one of the Carnet conferences quite a few years ago, maybe four or five, six years ago, and I wish I could remember the speaker, you would probably know his name. Um, but he was talking about he said, When when you meet someone and if A is they are completely lost, what is Z? If you're looking on the scale of A to Z, if they're lost at A, what is Z? I think our first instinct is to say, Oh, they're saved. No, he said that means they're ready for salvation. That means all along the way, somebody has met them at at the level of D. Somebody else met them at the level of J, and then up to Q to where they're finally ready to receive the Lord. So I I and I've shared that with our staff and with our volunteers over the over the years. You're we may be meeting somebody at J or R, or we might be meeting them at Y or Z. Um But be faithful in wherever they are and whatever God gives you to share with them in that moment. Realize that you're part of the process of the planting, the watering, and then the sowing. Um and I think that can be encouraging no matter what you do. It's 'cause I think salvation is is a relational thing sometimes when you have a relationship with somebody, which is part of what we do is try to start a relationship with them so we can um introduce them to that.

SPEAKER_02 52:05

Yeah, I really I really like that analogy of A through Z. Um I often think about it as like flights of stairs going to the next floor, and sometimes we meet someone right where they are at and you can't ask someone to skip five steps because they will trip. If you you know, maybe someone can skip one step or two, but not five or seven. And that flight of stairs might be ten ten steps to get to that next uh level. And so it's good to meet someone where they're at and help them with, you know, the next step or the current step. And um but ultimately, you know, yeah, I I think that's a beautiful analogy of you might be meeting them in the middle of the alphabet and but they may not be ready for the you know, they're not at Z quite yet.

SPEAKER_00 52:54

Yeah, and and most of the time we are able to pray for them. You know, there's very few times when anybody turns down prayer. Um you know, there's a few times when you've gotten a no, a hand comes up, but it's it's pretty rare, even even nowadays where there's so much kind of sh there's a shell of hardness around so many people, there's something that that'll soften someone's heart because they are met with such compassion when they come into our centers. They're treated with such love and kindness. And like Shelly said about the the young woman she was talking to, nobody's talked to her about her health before. And so just the fact that we do that um is really meaningful. And so then when we follow that up at the end and we might get to talk about the Lord a little bit, and we follow it up with prayer, that's definitely um watering some seeds. And I think that's really important.

SPEAKER_02 53:43

That's so good. Well, Laura and Shelly, I've really enjoyed having you on here. This has been so good. And for those who are listening, if you need you know, that seasoned person, I I would say Shelly and Laura would probably be open to helping helping answer hard questions as you're running into, you know, what do I do with this or doing with that? And so feel free to connect and reach out, uh, because that's what you know, that's what we're all about is helping each other and this great work. And and so um so Laura, would you wrap up our podcast with a prayer? And then Shelly, would you come in afterwards and also pray?

SPEAKER_00 54:21

Absolutely. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 54:23

Go ahead, Laura.

SPEAKER_00 54:24

Father, Father, we are so thankful for um the work that you've given us to do. Lord, you put something in our hand that you have given us specifically to do. Um whoever's listening, Lord, they may not be doing what I'm doing or what Shelly's doing or what Jacob is doing. But you've given us all work, Lord, that is useful in your kingdom, Father God. So the our heart's cry is that we would be used in your kingdom, Father, in this dark world that we live in, this culture that is is has turned away from you, Father, and and we've gone our own way as a culture. But Lord, hear our prayers that the people that believe in you, Lord, and that want to honor you and glorify you, that we would understand, Father, that whatever you've given us to do, that is our task and that is our job. So Shelley and I both are so grateful for the work of pregnancy centers and that you've called us to this great work, Lord God. That we pray for every woman who walks in our doors and in the doors of all of our uh uh sister centers that are all over the United States, Lord, that you would draw them to us, that you would bring them to us, Father, no matter uh how much marketing is leading them another way, that you'll bring them to our pregnancy centers and our communities, Lord God, and they'll find hope. They'll find refreshing for their souls, Lord God. They'll find kindness and mercy and compassion. And that is our cry, Father God, that you would use us and help us to understand how to be used by you. And I pray that in Jesus' name.

SPEAKER_01 55:53

Lord, we just are are so humbled and just encouraged anew at the reminders that you've given us just through doing this show, Lord, of all the stories, all the ways that you have worked, all the ways that you have been glorified, all the lives that you have changed and saved um through this ministry and through the pro-life work of many others. God, we just thank you that you're a God who sees us and you see um when we need encouragement and you uh you meet us where we are. You you know that um we are weak. And when we are weak, you are strong, God. And so um we thank you that you strengthen us when we need strength and that you give us stories to encourage us along the way and to keep us fighting this fight, God. Um that we're honored to be a part of a small part of your kingdom work, Lord, and we just ask that you continue to to bless the work of our hands. Um I pray for anyone listening who is uh prayerfully considering getting more involved in the pro-life um stand. God, we need more people to come alongside us in prayer and in um service and in uh financial support. And so, Lord, please just just prick their hearts at this time um that they can get plugged in to whatever center that is that's closest to them, or we would love for them to get connected in that way. And we just thank you for again for all that you've done uh through these ministries over the years, and we continue to pray that you'll bring more and more people for us to serve in Jesus' name. Amen.

SPEAKER_02 57:41

Amen.